Brian
I fully agree, professional pilots engage the autopilot for most of there fl
ights. They earn there money when something goes wrong.
And sometimes they don't like keeping a plane in a stall from 30,000 + feet u
ntil hits the water.
I have only had my IMC for a year and did the training and test in my Europa
. Best bit of training I have done.
Let's not try and kill permit aeroplanes being allowed to fly in IMC when th
e facts don't support the predicted doom and gloom.
Kevin Challis
> On 9 Sep 2014, at 14:56, "Brian Davies" <brian.davies@clara.co.uk> wrote:
>
> =9Cif we have a plethora of Permit built and operated aircraft flyin
g / departing / returning under IFR we will inevitably be reading about its t
ragic results, I would be devastated to read of such tragedies in the press.
=9D
>
> David, I think this is a bit sensationalistic and flies in the face of the
facts. Pilots in the USA have been able to fly IFR in home built aircraft f
or many years and the ground is not littered with smoking wreckage.
>
> The very understandable comments from the professional pilots in our commu
nity are also not supported by the stats. There are a large number of (UK)
IMC rated pilots flying PA28s, for example, and I think there has only been
two accidents in total since the IMCR was introduced. Compare this with th
e number of accidents caused by VFR pilots scud running.
>
> All of these issues have been fully and professionally examined as part of
the work that has led to the present trials that are taking place. That is w
hy it has taken 6 years to get to this stage. Any home built aircraft that i
s approved for night/IFR will have been through a very thorough testing proc
ess that is at least equivalent to that required for a certified aircraft.
>
> Regards
>
> Brian Davies
>
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-ser
ver@matronics.com] On Behalf Of DAVID JOYCE
> Sent: 09 September 2014 10:41
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas
>
> This is a really interesting discussion and I have to say that I am in to
tal agreement about currency and despite having had an IMC rating for 20+ ye
ars do not and will not deliberately fly into IMC conditions as a matter of o
pen choice, I only ever did the rating to use as a challenge to improve my f
lying and as a last chance get out of jail free card.
>
> I concur with Jonathans comments that if we have a plethora of Permit buil
t and operated aircraft flying / departing / returning under IFR we will ine
vitably be reading about its tragic results, I would be devastated to read o
f such tragedies in the press.
>
> There are many different standards of build some are stunning some are dog
s, even with the annual permit system they still get through ( I have to say
that the same happens with CAA and EASA aircraft as well). if we have a ple
thora of Permit built and operated aircraft flying / departing / returning u
nder IFR we will inevitably be reading about its tragic results, I would be d
evastated to read of such tragedies in the press.
> The other one
>
> Sent to you by David Joyce
> www.eastmidsspas.com
>
> PLEASE NOTE WE HAVE MOVED AND ARE NOW AT
> The Zycomm Building 51 Nottingham Road Ripley Derbys DE5 3AS
> 160 Meters from Sainsbury's Island
>
> Same Phone 0800 4102122 and Direct Mobile 07973 675755
>
>
> From: Fred Klein <fklein@orcasonline.com>
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Monday, 8 September 2014, 23:44
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas
>
>
> Jonathonthanks for your educated and well-founded opinion
particularly your emphasis on the importance of true =9Ccurrency
=9D, not just by-the-book currencysimilar reasoning has kept me in t
he ranks of VFR aviatorsF.
>
> On Sep 8, 2014, at 3:07 PM, jonathanmilbank <jdmilbank@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
.uk>
> >
> > Permit me to annoy you all intensely. After more than four decades of ea
rning my living as a pilot, military and civilian, and having held a full in
strument rating for over 32 years, wild horses couldn't drag me and my Europ
a into IMC or night conditions, even if my aircraft had all the required bel
ls and whistles.
> >
> > Single-engined in those conditions doesn't seem wise to me, especially i
n a glass-fibre airframe in conditions where you can't see and avoid potenti
al lightning activity.
> >
> > Furthermore procedural instrument flying is a skill where you need to ke
ep very current. An hour or so each month just isn't going to cut it. Me and
my colleagues find that just a week or two of holiday before resuming fligh
t operations, puts most pilots (if they're being honest) somewhat behind the
mental drag curve for a day or two after returning to duty.
> >
> > And we have the advantage of an Airbus suite of EFIS, Flight Directors a
nd unbeatable automation, plus two pairs of eyes and ears to monitor the sit
uation.
> >
> > Yes I have also flown IMC in earlier days as single pilot with no stabil
isation nor autoflight systems, doing things like QGH and GCA in the militar
y. That would make anyone sweat.
> >
> > So have fun if you must and I'll hope not to read of any sad CFIT storie
s.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430200#430200
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigatorsp; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
> = -->
>
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>
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