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RE: Europa-List: Smart Ass

Subject: RE: Europa-List: Smart Ass
From: Karl Heindl <kheindl@msn.com>
Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 15:00:22
David=2C
I was also looking for the installation manual=2C but without success. Ther
e is one website but they want my credit card details for a trial membershi
p. Has Mark got it online somewhere ?
regards Karl

Date: Sun=2C 11 May 2014 14:31:30 +0100
From: stranfaer@btinternet.com
Subject: Europa-List: Smart Ass

 David
I agree entirely=2C I have contacted Mark burton and he informs me the mark
 2 version is in test and is a few months away. Cost appears to be very rea
sonable!
Can you enlighten us all if it is retro fittable? and how easy to do partic
ularly on a classic?rgdsDJ Sent to you by David Joyce
www.eastmidsspas.com   PLEASE NOTE WE HAVE MOVED AND ARE NOW ATThe Zycomm B
uilding 51 Nottingham Road Ripley Derbys DE5 3AS160 Meters from Sainsbury's
 Island Same Phone 0800 4102122 and Direct Mobile 07973 675755

        From:=0A
 David Joyce <davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk>
 To: europa-list@matronics.com 
 Sent: Sunday=2C 11 May 2014=2C 11:42
 Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Re:  Europa-Li
st: Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Europa Crash in  L=FCbeck/Germany
   
>

Graham=2C Sorry to be butting in on your debate with Tim=2C and I see where
 you are coming from now=2C but can I just add that the SmartASS is g compe
nsated so it gives exactly the same 'margin over stall' information as an A
OA device (and at a fraction of the price). It might appear that I am pushi
ng this as if I had some=0A
 commercial tie up=2C which is not the case. I am evangelical about it beca
use we have now had (subject to confirmation in this latest case) 6 Europas
 lost to stall/spin accidents=2C an appalling statistic for a plane that fl
ies so beautifully and is slippery enough not to lose speed rapidly. There 
have of course been countless crashes of other types also=2C but in our rel
atively small and tight knit Europa community it is truly sobering and we s
hould all be asking ourselves are we confident of not becoming number 7.
Regards=2C David Joyce=2C G-XSDJ


 GRAHAM SINGLETON <grahamsingleton@btinternet.com> wrote:
> Tim
> maybe we are mixing things a bit. ASI will measure instantly changes in a
irspeed. When AoA changes aircraft speed will not change instantly but will
 take several seconds.
>=0A
 The force causing change of airspeed is increase or decrease in drag=2C us
ually quite a small force.
> During take off acceleration is caused by engine thrust and ASI will reco
rd speed of course=2C as soon as the aircraft is flying AoA should quickly 
settle at best climb.
> Stall occurs at the same AoA whatever airspeed or total weight is. (I'm t
hinking aloud here)
> In fact best climb=2C cruise or glide speeds are also at fixed AoAs. They
 are not at fixed airspeeds but
> change as all up weight changes.
> AoA is much the best primary flight control instrument. That's why fast j
ets use it.
> A pity AoA meters aren't mass produced like ASIs are!
> best regards
> Graham
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
> From: houlihan <houlihan@blueyonder.co.uk>
> To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday=2C 11 May 2014=2C 8:34
> Subject: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: 
Re: Europa-List: Europa Crash in L=FCbeck/Germany
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Graham.
> 
> We may be talking apples against pears here BUT if what you say is true t
hen on takeoff I would be at 100' thinking about retracting the undercarria
ge before the ASI has moved from zero.
> 
> I agree it takes time to accelerate or decelerate a 600kg mass but the pr
essure measurement showing movement relative to the local air mass will be 
indicated within a small fraction of a second even using our normal mechani
cal manometers that are calibrated in airspeed and could be even quicker us
ing electronic pressure sensors close to the pitot head.
> 
> True an AOA or alpha system would be helpful but I=0A
 just want to be warned if through lack of attention or being distracted I 
allow my speed to decay =2C these lack of attention or distraction events u
sually build up slowly without it being noticed and I would guess rarely ha
ppens over one or two seconds.
> 
> best regards
> 
> Tim 
> 
> 
> 
> On 10 May 2014 22:28=2C GRAHAM SINGLETON <grahamsingleton@btinternet.com>
 wrote:
> 
> Tim
>> don't think so =2C the ASI won't move (or shouldn't!) until the aircraft
 has accelerated=2C or worse slowed down and that takes many seconds.
>> When it says "stall speed!" you.ve already stalled. Not a lot of use.
>> Graham
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ________________________________
>> From: houlihan <houlihan@blueyonder.co.uk>
>> To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday=2C 10 May 2014=2C 14:31
>> Subject: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List: Europa Crash in 
L=FCbeck/Germany
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Hi Graham.
>> 
>> 
>> I think you may have put the decimal point in the wrong place. I appreci
ate what you are suggesting but 20 seconds ?
>> I bet the real figure is much less than a second.
>> Mind you how would you measure the lag =2C my ASI seems to move at the s
peed of light at times.
>> 
>> 
>> Tim
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 10 May 2014 13:19=2C GRAHAM SINGLETON <grahamsingleton@btinternet.com
> wrote:
>> 
>> Or an AoA meter as primary attitude/speed instrument. The ASI is always 
20 seconds too late.
>>> Very sad=2C I met Manfred while he was building. A very nice man and a 
nice Europa.
>>> Graham
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ________________________________
>>> From: David Joyce <davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk>
>>> To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday=2C 10 May 2014=2C 12:36
>>> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Europa Crash in L=FCbeck/Germany
>>> 
>>>=0A

g.uk>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I strongly suspect that this another case where a SmartASS or the equiv
alent might have saved them both. David Joyce=2C G-XSDJ
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List tp://fo
rums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution 
>> 
>> http://www.matronics.com/con==============
== 
>> 
>> arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
> tp://forums.matronics.com
> _blank">http://www.==================
======/
> ============avigator?Europa-List" target="_blan
k">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?= Same great content also=0A
ttp://forums.matronics.com/" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com/
sp=3B                     -nics.com/contribution" target="_blank">http://
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