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Re: Europa-List: A question to the American "Europeans"

Subject: Re: Europa-List: A question to the American "Europeans"
From: Curtis <cjaussi@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2012 14:05:40
It is my understanding that you can obtain flight training even for a PPL in
 your own experimental aircraft and pay the instructor.  This would be a goo
d question to ask EAA.

Sent from my iPad

On Sep 17, 2012, at 7:38 AM, Peter Zutrauen <peterz@zutrasoft.com> wrote:

> In Canada it's my understanding that it's just an insurance question for h
ull coverage - which typically is not taken until their requisite number of h
ours is obtained.
> 
> Cheers,
> Pete
> A239
> Ottawa, Canada
> 
> 
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 9:08 AM, Robert Borger <rlborger@mac.com> wrote:
> Svein, et. al.,
> 
> Big old Catch 22 over here in FAA land.  To do a proper checkout one must h
ave a CFI to do the instruction.  The CFI normally will charge for their ins
truction time.  But one is not allowed to earn income through the use of an e
xperimental amateur built aircraft.  So try to find a qualified CFI with exp
erience in the transition aircraft who will do it for no charge.
> 
> I happen to have a friend who is a CFI but is not a professional flight in
structor.  He has given me and others proper checkouts in various experiment
al amateur built aircraft for not charge.  Guys like that are darn few and f
ar between over here.
> 
> Blue skies & tailwinds,
> Bob Borger
> Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop.
> Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP
> 3705 Lynchburg Dr.
> Corinth, TX  76208-5331
> Cel: 817-992-1117
> rlborger@mac.com
> 
> On Sep 17, 2012, at 2:46 AM, Sidsel & Svein Johnsen <sidsel.svein@oslo.onl
ine.no> wrote:
> 
> NTSB issued in May a very interesting report on accidents with amateur-bui
lt airplanes compared to certified airplanes, based on detailed evaluation o
f the numbers behind the summary statistics:
> http://www.ntsb.gov/doclib/reports/2012/SS1201.pdf
>  
> One of their findings is that many more accidents caused by loss of contro
l in the air happen with amateur-built than with certified airplanes, and th
at a high percentage is with second-hand airplanes a short time after being p
urchased.   NTSB points to the fact that FAA do not follow the same practice
 as many other countries do, in that FAA do not require a pre-approved test f
light program, nor approval of a report on the test flying (only a log book e
ntry that test flight has been completed), which in turn may cause the pilot
=99s operating handbook/flight manual to be lacking important airplane
 characteristics.
>  
> What the NTSB report do not say anything about, however, is mandatory tran
sition training and check out in the specific amateur-built airplane.  Under
 the joint European pilot license regime (JAR-FCL), we must receive such tra
ining and have it entered in our log book.  This means that before we can fl
y the Europa we have built (unless approved by our CAA to perform the very f
irst flight) we must receive such airplane-specific rating, and also before w
e may pilot another Europa than our own, no matter how many hours we have lo
gged in our own plane and irrespective of all the similarities between two i
ndividual Europas.
>  
> Therefore the following question to the American Europeans on this forum: 
 Before you can legally be the pilot of ANY experimental classed, amateur-bu
ilt airplane, are you not required by FAA to receive transition training/rat
ing check-out by a pre-approved CFI or other experienced, approved person, e
ven for flying a =9Csister=9D airplane of the same type and mode
l that you may already be experienced in?
>  
> Regards,
> Svein
> LN-SKJ
> 
> 
> 
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