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Re: Europa-List: Fuel tank - bulges and leakage.

Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel tank - bulges and leakage.
From: Robert Borger <rlborger@mac.com>
Date: Thu, 1 May 2008 21:18:12

Gary,

Count me in.

Check six,
Bob Borger
Europa Kit #A221 N914XL, XS Mono, Intercooled 914, Airmaster C/S
http://www.europaowners.org/N914XL
(90%) tail kit done, wings closed, cockpit module installed, pitch  
system in, landing gear complete, rudder system in with Singleton Mod,  
outrigger mod in, Fuselage Top on, lift/drag/flap pins in, wing  
incidence set, tie bar in, flap drive in,  baggage bay in. Fuel system  
complete.  Rotax and Airmaster installed.  Mods 62, 66, 70 & 72 done.   
Completed the instrument panel install.   Europa interior kit being  
installed.  Installed windows.  Working in -  25 Electrical, 28 Flaps,  
30 Fuel System, 32 Tail, 34 Door Latches & 35 Doors, 37 Finishing.    
Mostly finishing these days.
3705 Lynchburg Dr.
Corinth, TX  76208
Home:  940-497-2123
Cel:  817-992-1117


On May 1, 2008, at 12:02, Gary Leinberger wrote:

> >
>
> I just replaced mine,although I did it before putting in the cockpit
> module - it is actually not too bad to do from the bottom and may in
> fact be easier from the top - but you do need to cut out the  
> headrests -
> and be ready to totally destroy the old tank, and sand out pieces of  
> the
> tank that end up "resined" to the rear upright of the cockpit module  
> - a
> very sloppy job - the real problem when working from the top, as I see
> it - is that you can't  put in the channel or T pieces from the top -
> you essentially have to work through the holes for the spars and the
> bottom hole for the fuel outlets from the tank -  I was thinking  
> however
> that part of the problem in this tank may be that we glass it in too
> tightly in a few places and as it moves from expansion, it works the
> plastic and we get stress cracks - this was the problem on my first  
> tank
> - the stress came from using too much air pressure to test the  
> system -
> but at best I only cycled the tank to expansion a few times - so if it
> failed then, it isn't too much of leap to suggest that regular  
> expansion
> from temperature changes could do the same - especially if the tank is
> firmly held by fiberglass in a few places - the corner on the outside
> edge below the overhang at top seems to be a particular place to
> accumulate stress
>
> Maybe it would be smarter when replacing a tank to build a shelf below
> that the tank sits on and then strap the tank in with enough elastic
> slack to allow movement of the tank - yet still have enough strength  
> to
> avoid the tank breaking loose in a crash - but the stress cracks I got
> from just a few cycles of air pressure really worry me -
>
> Perhaps some of us could get together and fund the building of a
> prototype aluminum (or something else) tank - once we had a design we
> could easily reproduce it at much lower cost - I doubt if the factory
> could do it because of the nannies in the English  PFA - but we  
> could do
> it in the US - I would be more than happy to put a hundred dollars  
> or so
> to fund development - I don't know how many of us are worried about  
> this
> but 50 builders at $100 each - is  $5000 - would this be enough to do
> this? By the way a replacement tank is 110 pounds and shipping is
> another 110 pounds - total cost is over $400 - just for the tank - and
> maybe 30-50 hours to replace it - so is $100 worth of insurance each  
> to
> have a better fix available worth it? I think so - any feedback from
> people that know something about the cost of prototyping - I know the
> first one is always expensive - but the second one should be a lot
> cheaper -
>
>
> Gary Leinberger
> A237
> gleinberger@millersville.edu
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Venu Rao
> Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2008 1:17 AM
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel tank - bulges and leakage.
>
>
> I'm rather concerned about this too. Going to have a look at my tank  
> for
> signs of bulging.
>
> Almost certain I'm converting the mono to a conventional through Bob
> Berube. Just need to price it out.
>
> Do you know if the tank can be replaced easily?
>
> This forum is invaluable!
> Hope all's well.
> Cheers
>
> Venu
>
> Cell: (512) 771-3286
>
> On Apr 30, 2008, at 22:18, Fred Klein <fklein@orcasonline.com> wrote:
>
>> <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>>
>> On Wednesday, Apr 30, 2008, at 13:46 US/Pacific, Sidsel & Svein
>> Johnsen wrote:
>>
>>> --> <sidsel.svein@oslo.online.no
>>>>
>>>
>>> All,
>>>
>>> Preventing the tank from bulging too much forward will of course
>>> prevent it touching any of the controls or the wing spar (in which
>>> case the strap on the left spar might catch on the bulge during
>>> withdrawal/installation).
>>
>> Before getting Svein's thoughtful and informative post (thank you
>> Svein!), I spent some time looking for a solution to potential  
>> bulging
>
>> in my tank (which came w/ kit # A194, shipped from the factory in
>> fall, 2000).
>>
>> In order to "contain" the (outward)  bulging, I reset my spacers
>> (which have generous curves at the corners of the specified lay up)  
>> to
>
>> ensure a gap between tank (dry and never filled w/ anything)  of
>> between 1/8" and 1/4" and maintaining 1/4" clearance from the aileron
>> control rod, I was planning to do the following:
>>
>> Insert a piece of 1/8" thick plywood, 6.25" x 34",  w/ 1 layer of bid
>> each side between the spacers and the front face of the tank,
>> cushioning the plywood w/ 1/8" thick "sill sealer" (I believe it is a
>> closed cell polypropylene foam available in 6" rolls at any building
>> supply) between the plywood and the forward face of the tank. Prior  
>> to
>
>> insertion, I would add a 3/4" x 2" x 34" foam stiffener w/ 2 layers
>> bid on the forward face of the plywood. The plywood would be held in
>> place w/ a 2 ply bid 2" wide tape which laps onto the underside of  
>> the
>
>> FG "shelf" (previously installed as per manual). In doing this, my
>> goal would be to resist "bulging" of the forward face of the tank.
>>
>> Having reviewed Svein's post, I will not be doing anything until we
>> have more information, hopefully in answer to Svein's questions on  
>> the
>
>> nature of the HDPE used in our tanks.
>>
>> I do appreciate so much the value of this forum as we attempt to
>> address this insidious problem.
>>
>> Fred
>>
>>
>> --
>> This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>



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