I appreciate my SmartAss....very effective, and did indeed nag me when i was
once distracted (at altitude though) in my little underpowered HB, to my pl
easant surprise :-)
> On Nov 2, 2017, at 11:44 AM, davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk wrote:
>
> Raimo, I like the Smartass because it is simple, cheap and very effective,
but any device giving warnin of impending stall coming at you through you h
eadset in a way you cannot ignore is good. Certainly it should be related to
angle of attack rather than raw speed, but Smartass is g compensated so tha
t its trigger levels are effectively the same as if measuring AOA, since the
re is a precise mathematical relationship between air speed, g forces and AO
A. The AOA systems I have come across cost the wrong side of =C2=A31000 and a
re complex to fit, whilst Smartass costs =C2=A3200 and is dead simple to fit
. It also for good measure reminds you to put the gear down!. The standard E
uropa stall warner with a buzzer in the head rest is in my experience next t
o useless and has no doubt been wingeing almost inaudibly (to the ageing ear
equipped with the latest ANR headsets) in all the (significant number) of E
uropa stall spin accidents.
>
> How many fatal accidents are you aware of where an ELT saved the day? That
is where the pilot survive the landing was unable to summon help and died b
efore help arrived but could have been saved had he been found within a few h
ours. No doubt there are some, but I cannot recall any.
>
> Regards, David
>
>
>
>
>> On 2017-11-02 11:12, Raimo Toivio wrote:
>>
>> Hi David,
>>
>> this is fun.
>>
>> ELT is an interesting question.
>>
>> Maybe there are few landings where you are not either dead or able to use
a PLB in UK.
>> But in Finland, by statistically, most landings are succesfull ie you are
alive and you are able to use your PLB if you like so.
>> I assume we are talking about forced landings.
>> Personally I would launch my PLB when airborne and well before contacting
the earth.
>>
>> Smart ass is a nice gizmo, but do we really need it (if we are real Pilot
s)?
>> If it really were so lifesaver, I assume it would be mandatory in every a
c.
>> Should you consider also a stick shaker?
>> Personally I do like my Angle of Attack -system
>> (you know it=C2=B4s an essential equipment if you wanna land your fighter
to the deck of your aircraft carrier...).
>> Actually that=C2=B4s the only way to really know what=C2=B4s happening ri
ght now and how far or how close you are from stalling situation.
>> Angle of Attack is everything. Speed is nothing, as well as weight, temp,
air density or your very personal size. Just AofA!
>>
>> Also, my Europas original EA stall warner (audio-visual /horn and a giant
hight bright blue led in the field of view) works also satisfactorily.
>> However, I have seen it only when I=C2=B4m stalling by purpose and every t
ime just before touch down.
>> BTW I have always used 70 knots during the final until on the ground effe
ct.
>> Also, when landing to my strip 12/30, total lenght 300 metres.
>>
>> David, 2018 is coming soon. I will start to prepare my lakeside Sauna for
you.
>> Yes, we should really get into a "Mine=C2=B4s bigger than your=C2=B4s sor
t of argument".
>> That=C2=B4s easier to verify in sauna if I call couple of Ladies to join u
s.
>> Or should you bring one for you from UK?
>>
>> I have discussed this thing many times with girls.
>> Maybe yours is a little longer than mine (40 mn means 6%).
>> Then you count UK not England and in that case I could count Sweden-Finla
nd...
>> However, girls arguments that the lenght is nothing - only TTS (The Total
Size) matters!
>>
>> Your area /size (UK) is 242.000 km=C2=B2 (England only 130.000 km=C2=B2).
>> My area /size (Finland) is 338.000 km=C2=B2.
>> So, mine is significantly larger (40%).
>> So far, most girls have been here with me happy.
>>
>> Your total population is about 65.000.000 persons and we have 5.500.000.
>> That means you David have 3.700 m=C2=B2 of UK and I have 61.500 m=C2=B2 o
f Finland.
>> That means mine is actually almost 17 times bigger than yours.
>>
>> This is also argument for ELT & PLB; it is 17 times more valuable here th
an in UK an average.
>> I am pretty sure you do agree this.
>>
>> This land is so atractive that little Russians have tried to get it many t
imes,
>> but we have pushed them back quite easily every time and will do it again
if necessary.
>> That=C2=B4s easy because Finnish Airforce have had and have the most succ
esfull pilots in the world
>> (pls read the statistics around WWII).
>>
>> "So few have not been ever so thankful to so few"
>>
>> I hardly can wait your comments and also sauna test match FIN-UK with gir
ls.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Raimo
>> Finland
>> OH-XRT
>>
>> PS: I checked my Europa=C2=B4s logbook; actually I have logged 600 flight
hours and 800 landings since 2007
>> (this year unfortunately none w RT, but 50 hours by C172 OH-CVK and Lamco
Cub OH-U666 + one hour in a hot Air Balloon "Finland 100-years" OH-FIN")
>>
>>
>> davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk kirjoitti 2.11.2017 klo 11:09:
>>> Raimo, Yes of course I have looked down on those very remote and rugged s
paces in Finland and we do infact have some equally remote and unlandable pl
aces in the UK (try flying round all the remote Scottish islands), but it do
esn't alter the point that there are few landings where you are not either d
ead or able to use a PLB. Two or three hundred euros invested in a Smartass i
s much more likely to save your life than a similar amount spent on an ELT i
n addition to a PLB.
>>>
>>> Much tempted by the idea of some more Aviation beer and Sauna in 2018
. Regards, David
>>>
>>> PS We shouldn't really get into a 'Mine's bigger than yours' sort of arg
ument, but I find that it is around 620nm from t to bottom of Finland and 66
0nm top to bottom of UK!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 2017-11-01 21:09, Raimo Toivio wrote:
>>>
>>> Dear David,
>>>
>>> you are right as usually, but however, think about accident in the remot
e place (and you have not launched your PLB),
>>> ELT is your only hope (if you happen to be alive) . I do understand that
it is not so easy to you to understand there are really unpopulated places i
n the world.
>>>
>>> Like Finland. You have flown here a lot. Think.
>>>
>>> Really, all the pilots are not flying in the Great Britain!!!
>>>
>>> (which is a very little put populated - island somewhere).
>>>
>>> For example Me, after not-so-succesfull landing to any remote private st
rip here with my monowheel.
>>> To my home strips, where there are people available from hundreds of met
ers. They just look, maybe!!!
>>> Raimo has left his aircraft there, and same time I am loosing maybe my l
ife! In that case, ELT were superb.
>>>
>>> So far, I have had about 600 landings with my Mono, and still one prop (
AirMaster).
>>>
>>> David, I=C2=B4m pretty sure You get it!
>>>
>>> Go on! I know you can have your burst!
>>>
>>> Or, maybe you need a real Finnish Sauna to get out your real Europa Mind
?
>>>
>>> ***
>>> About me /my status:
>>>
>>> - my Europa OH-XRT is still not flyable but will be during early 2018 *
>>> - my Lamco OH-U666 (a bushplane) is flyable now finally after my crash o
ne year ago
>>> - my very Beloved Cesna OH-CVK (which I owned 1996-2012) is here back ag
ain.
>>> - my Antonov AN-2 HA-MDO is in Sweden, but it will be soon here.
>>>
>>> David,
>>> pls fly here duging The 2018 - the cows are away!
>>>
>>> Just land EFRT 12/30 or 03/21 if you like so.
>>>
>>> Raimo
>>> OH-XRT
>>> Finland
>>>
>>> davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk kirjoitti 1.11.2017 klo 20:58:
>>>
>>>
>>> Raimo, It's great to hear from you again! hope that your engine woes are
sorted and that we can look forward to more accounts of your fascinating fl
ying exploits.
>>>
>>> Although there is always great sense in what you say, in this context
I would take a slightly different approach. I would say there are two sorts
of 'typical' - firstly the sort of accident where you walk away from it and
don't need much in the way of help - or if you do then you are in a state t
o work your mobile, or your PLB assuming you have landed in orderly fashion e
ither in mid ocean or in a remote part of Finland (and there is plenty of th
at!). The other sort of typical is sadly the sort of accident you do not wal
k away from and very few of those are survived with or without an ELT. Sadly
some 2% of us (i.e. GA pilots in general) die from stall/spin accidents, e
ntirely unsurviveable. My plea would be for folk to address that possibility
more seriously. Prevention is the answer, not an ELT to get help more quick
ly after the event. There are suggestions of how you can address this issue o
n the (beautiful new) club website in the 'Flying' section.
>>>
>>> Regards, David Joyce, GXSDJ
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 2017-11-01 18:29, Raimo Toivio wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Jon,
>>>
>>> I do agree.
>>>
>>> One more thing: PLB must be launched manually, but ELT should work autom
atically after your critical impact.
>>>
>>> It=C2=B4s easy to imagine a situation where you have no time to switch o
n your PLB or you even forget to do it during your possible more or less pan
ic situation
>>>
>>> (when trying to survive out from your disaster).
>>>
>>> What=C2=B4s a typical accident? It=C2=B4s during take off or landing. If
shit happens then, PLB is useless!
>>>
>>> PLB is very nice when you happen to lose your engine in the high up alti
tude, or have made a succesfull emergency landing to the remote
>>>
>>> (that=C2=B4s potential for me, here in Finland, which is practically emp
ty [wolves will not call emergency, they just eat you]).
>>>
>>> I love my PLB also because I fly regularly over the sea between Finland a
nd Sweden. That flight is 1 hour over open seawater without islands.
>>>
>>> Of course I fly high up using typically my very favourite FL69 (Swedish f
emale ATC love my request to use it and that=C2=B4s why I have no Turbo),
>>>
>>> but in the case of silence with my best glide ratio (1:17, w featherable
VSuperb AirMaster), I am able to glide say practically about 35 km in theor
y.
>>>
>>> So, there is still a cap almost 200 km = 45 min when it=C2=B4s easy to
monitor your engine and listen strange sounds...
>>>
>>> (in a real life I put my autopilot on and start to listen hi-fi music th
rough my HS800 via B&O and usually sleep say half an hour).
>>>
>>> I would like to say:
>>>
>>> ELT is essential and PLB is a nice extra...
>>>
>>> (isn=C2=B4t it strange that what older you are, that more you are thinki
ng things like that, should be vice versa...)
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Raimo
>>> Finland
>>> OH-XRT
>>> The fastest Europa ever build
>>> (and only 4-seater)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> italianjon kirjoitti 1.11.2017 klo 17:30:
>>>
>>> Just to throw my thoughts on the ELT/PLB argument, as I have been debati
ng for a while on whether to get one. This information came from a VERY reli
able source, someone who is involved in the SAR industry.
>>>
>>> For the record I had just a PLB, but I now have both.
>>>
>>> With an ELT action will always be taken, and it will be immediate, as th
ey have all information readily available through the registration authoriti
es. On a PLB, action will only be taken once it is a confirmed emergency.
>>>
>>> I have to admit I thought my leg was being pulled until I saw the forms.
On the ELT registration form that I completed, I only completed my details,
and that was it. WIth the PLB form I had to complete the contact details of
three additional people who know my movements and can be contacted in the e
vent that the PLB is activated.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=474097#474097
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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