Hang on folks. We need to remember how, having got above cloud, we are
going to get back down. In Europe that requires ADF, DME as a minimum.
Between the 2 of them costs of 6,000 ish. Most of the ILS's require a
DME as well, since the demise of the marker beacons. Though I am not
sure if marker beacon recievers are still mandatory for IFR, they may
well be. I would support being able to fly my Europa in cloud, I
certainly would not want to fly it serious IFR. As for night, well
night flying has always seemed a waste of good drinking time!
Regards
Pete
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeremy
Davey
Subject: RE: Europa-List: What's your position on Night and IMC
privileges for Permit aircraft in the UK?
--> <EuropaFlyer_3@msn.com>
Mike,
Thanks for your support in this! (Everyone, please keep the responses
coming, the more I get, the stronger the case.)
Can I just clarify something? This about IMC privileges in Permit
aircraft, not the IMC rating for pilots. In theory the same rules would
apply as for a C172 or PA-28 with similar capabilities - the use of
airways would depend on the pilot's level of license. So if he has a
full IR, up he goes! :-)
Now a separate but related topic of possible interest... The UK IMC
rating has been criticised in the past for existing solely for flying
schools to hold of more of our hard-earned cash, while training the
pilots to be just capable of being seriously dangerous to themselves and
their passengers. I have heard a case being made for abolishing the IMC
rating and insisting on full IRs.
The obstacle to a full IR, of course, is the cost. But in your own
Permit plane...? I think there is a significant safety case in here
somewhere!
Regards,
Jeremy
Jeremy Davey
Europa Monowheel 537M G-EZZA
Europa Club Vice-Chairman, Webmaster, PFA NC Representative
PFA EC Member
"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, then it
is possible you haven't grasped the severity of the situation." Tail
done Standard XS wings with mods underway CM installed in fuse (with
airbrakes fittings) 1200 build hours to date Intended fit: Rotax 914
turbo, Airmaster CS fully-feathering prop Lots of lights, buttons,
switches, gizmos, and alarms
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of M.J.
Gregory
Subject: RE: Europa-List: What's your position on Night and IMC
privileges for Permit aircraft in the UK?
--> <m.j.gregory@talk21.com>
Jeremy
Yes, I am strongly in favour of night and IMC privileges for Permit
aircraft, especially the Europa.
I firmly believe in pilots developing their skills so that they are able
to cope with conditions beyond those in which they normally fly.
Regular practice in both simulated and actual conditions would result in
people being much better placed to fly safely when faced with the
unexpected. It should not, however, be treated as a licence to fly
regardless of the weather any more than you would in a certified
aircraft.
For those not familiar with the privileges of a UK IMC rating, it is
important to understand that this is not a full Instrument Rating and
does not allow pilots to file an IFR flight plan (e.g. to fly airways).
The minimum equipment level required for a Permit aircraft to fly in IMC
should not necessarily be higher than that required for a certified
aircraft to fly in IMC, certainly not a full IFR panel. The aim should
be for people to be able to handle their aircraft safely in conditions
of limited visibility (e.g. flying through cloud) and follow
instructions such as a radar talk-down approach. Equipment such as ILS
could be added to the capability according to people's needs and
pockets.
Mike
Mike Gregory
Europa Club Safety Officer
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